Kenshinzen are FUN! and broke.

Kenshinzen are FUN! and broke.
Here is a problem with rank 3 kenshinzen. It says forego all normal attacks to make one attack against this is the important bit"every enemy that is within 5' of you in that round." Has anyone decided to apply the cheese of Fleet to this? Round goes like this: I move my full distance through the group of enemy. I use my (say water 4, fleet 6)100' move to pass within 5 feet of all 50 of them. Then I full attack the lot. BAM. 2 free raises on the attack to belt all of them. This is a great way to mess up group skirmishes. If you went through the Heavy Regulars path, and use a heavy weapon, you can devastate entire formations! Whee! For pure stupidity's sake, throw in Wind in Darkened Skies, the Anime Kata. I jump over ALL 50! I ignore ALL their armour! I spend 1 void, and lower their TNtbH by 5 as well! They ALL only get 2 raises against me! If I am still near them though...

Re: Kenshinzen are FUN! and broke.
Don’t forget your Kakita Bushi 1 + Hoturi’s Blade path to keep all your dice on this attack roll. I think the problem is with Fleet more then with Whirlwind attack. Maybe. Still, moving 40' and running along the front line of a unit you can still belt at least 8, 16 if they are tightly packed. Use a heavy weapon for max takedown with your Heavy Regulars path. The Hoturi's blade tech just helps you get into the Kenshinzen at insight rank 5 (if you pick a hard case Kenshinzen to duel) The full 7 insight rank progression is Kakita Bushi 1, Daidoji Heavy Regulars, Kakita Bushi 2, Hoturi's Blade, Kenshinzen 1,2,3. Insight rank 7. Run around them with a Tetsubo. -10 armour, +7 Increase damage Free Raises. Assume water 4, and that Tetsubo is a 6k3 +4k3 = 10k6 weapon. Without including any raises you take, or the 2 free from full attack, or from having a higher initiative than them. Include the full attack ones, and the free one from rank 5 heavy weapons, and it is 12k7. I have issue with Daidoji Heavy Regulars vs Hida Avenger Rank 1. one is a path, the other an advanced school. one gives you (Insight Rank) Free Damage raises to EVERY use of Heavy weapons for 1 insight rank, the other gives you max 3 raises a day.

I think that the last part of that Technique was a typo. However you are correct in that the way that it is worded you can do that. It isn't whirlwind attack as it is written it is attack everyone within your moevement range. I think the Centipede Tatoo is the worst combination however. Ise-zumi kenshinsen fu. They could probably kill an entire army singlehandedly. No. It doesn’t; say you attack everyone within your movement range, nor does it say that you attack everyone that WAS ever within 5’ of you that round. It says “IS” within 5’ of you. So at one point during your round, you may attack everyone within 5’ of you at that moment.

The full wording, "every enemy that is within 5' of you in that round", does indeed seem to indicate that it's everyone within your movement range. Or is that an official rules change from our Daimyo?

It's one of those things players should have dice thrown at them for trying, but probably legal anyway.

The full wording, "every enemy that is within 5' of you in that round", does indeed seem to indicate that it's everyone within your movement range. How are people along a 40’ line all within 5’ of you at once. The tech says “IS within 5' of you” not “WAS at some time 5' of you”.

Well, you activate it at the beginning of your attack. Then start moving. Any time the conditions are true you make an attack roll - while avoiding hurled d10 headshots.

Well, you activate it at the beginning of your attack. Then start moving. Any time the conditions are true you make an attack roll - while avoiding hurled d10 headshots. It still isn’t clear that you can attack WHILE moving. You can certainly, move, attack, then move. Also, even if you can, all thoses foe are still not all within 5’ of you when the attack roll is made.

Yeah, but it says "of you in that round" not, "of you when you make the attack roll". Hey, if my PC can use Way of the Willow to wipe out a charging deathseeker army then you'll just have to let yours kill everything in his 100' movement path! :)

Yeah, but it says "of you in that round" not, "of you when you make the attack roll". Hense the conflict. So, if an enemy was 5’ of you when the round started, and teleported away using the Sacred Ground spell to teleport 2000 miles away into a castle, this tech allows you to ignore the range limit of your attack and even attack through barriers?

I didn't think of that, but it makes the tech even better! Rock on! From an insane "strict reading of the rules" answer? Or a "ounce of common sense" answer? Because it makes a world of difference.

I didn't think of that, but it makes the tech even better! Rock on! From an insane "strict reading of the rules" answer? Or a "ounce of common sense" answer? Because it makes a world of difference. I have used “Obvious Stupidity” to justify rulings before. If not, I could single handedly destroy the system by pointing out the true ramifications of printed game text.

Wording of the technique: "You may forego all of your normal attacks in a combat round to instead deliver a single attack to every enemy within 5' of you in that round. You make a single attack roll for this special maneuver, and compare it to each opponent's TNtbH." (page 8, 4 Winds) Here is the peice of text that I am wrestling with, "instead deliver a single attack." The way I am reading it is that you can take the attack maneuver, like normal, but you are foregoing all your normal attacks. At some point in time you can make a 'single' attack on all the opponents that are within 5' of you at that moment. The Melee Attack Maneuver says, "You may attack once per round. If you are in the Attack Posture, you may move your full movement and attack, but must make one Raise to strike your target successfully. If you are in the Full Attack Posture you may move your full movement and still attack with no penalty." (page 167, 3rd Ed Rulebook) The problem that I am seeing with the other interpretation is that it indicates that the technique grants the Kenshinzen a variable range on his melee attack that could be anywhere from 1' to infinity. Let's say that you have 50' of movement and pass within 5' of an enemy every 10' moved. At the time of the Kenshinzen's attack, the first melee attack has a range of 40', the second has 30', the third has 20', the fourth has 10', and the last is within 5'. That is a really long sword! I would like to know what you guys think.

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